For almost 2 years now I’ve been trying to explain to my peers and elders on the advantages of using CSS and XHTML for development. The ease of use, flexibility, server load, changeability, etc. - these are all points to which I went into great detail. In some cases, even speaking in meeting to explain with documentation and graphs on how this will save us money and time.
After countless hours of research and explaining, I have finally been given the ok to develop the Holland Sentinel’s website with valid XHTML and CSS.
The first part of redesigning the site was to take out half of the stuff we didn’t need and make the site much simpler to navigate and view. On top of that we wanted the page to load quickly and available on as many possible Internet devises available (i.e. the using of CSS for structure).
After going back an forth about that we then begin to think on design. What is the new look going to say and how is it going to be said? What are our demographics? and more importantly - why? What do we have to do, and what are we allowed to do?
This question is still going on but we have gained some headway. I’ve come up with a beta version of the new Holland Sentinel website but still working on many things. You can take a peek at the new layout at http://hollandsentinel.com/schaapy/inprogress/.
Now I will have to warn you (if you haven’t already checked it out) - it’s not completed. I still have quite a bit to do and if it doesn’t work 100% in your browser it’s because you have a crappy browser (Netscape 4.x I’m looking at you) or it’s a bug that I haven’t got around to fixing yet.
On design - it’s not done either. This is where I am stuck and trying to seek advice. Where as there are some things I don’t have the power to change or take off the site - there is quite a bit I am allowed to do.
I would love input from a users point of view and is possible - design ideas or links to good designs for a paper. Note: I’ve seen almost every newspaper site in the States and many from other countries. Please don’t throw me the known popular sites as reference in design - unless you are pointing out a feature or item
Once again, I would like to point out that this site is completely XHTML 1.0 and CSS2 compliant. There are no tables in this site and the goal is to keep it that way. Due to constraints in Content Management Systems and output from banner systems - this isn’t going to be easy.
So let me know what you think.
posted on May 1, 2003 | 9:05 PM EST
Add to the discussion.
Make sure there is some eye catching content on the homepage to attract interest.
Scrolling on any page is evil. It would be nice to have any
page be screen-size but changing pages/screens still be fast.
Looks nice
maybe just me.. but fixed widths may be more user friendly in terms of screen size.
Unless this is a bug.. having it set up so the middle column collapses under the third in a small window
= bad and annoying.
Other than that .. it’s cool to see the sentinel let you have your way with their stuff schaap! Good luck.
These are all good points and ones that have been brought up and debated. I agree with you dan on the usability of a static width. I’m going back and forth on which one.
The biggest problem I’m having is getting certain browsers to understand the “min-width: xxx;” CSS function. IE is the major one. There’s a couple things I’m working on with JavaScript that will make a child elemant look at it’s parent.
In a nutshell, I might just make the front page a static width. The reason the center will fall below is because of I’m using float: instead of position:.
Besides that though - what about design. What should I change or move around? or am I on the right path so far.
note:
If this post sounds weird, I’m typing this while watching a movie.
hmm.. i still don’t know enough about css .. damn.
I think you know what’s good about your design.
A newsite should show more news on the front page. I realize the adspaces (car, house) must be necessary for some reason. But linking to more articles higher up on the screen might be an idea.
How about adding a feature that lets’ the user choose information priority.. or collapse the ads after seeing them once.
I’d also consider putting the “headlines, get headlines, todays feature” links over the top story area somehow. Those are cool features that get lost in the navigation .. maybe?
Here’s a little one .. maybe make the vertical borders solid . This might ease up on the eyes a bit.
You probably don’t want me to design the page for you. ;]
your on the right path though..
shiz. i’m stuck awake so i’ll tell you some more.
The one thing i don’t like about the sentinel page as it is now (real page) is that i have to go looking for headlines other than the top story.
I really like the idea of saying- “hey i’m interested in local news when i read the sentinel.. so fill the front page with local links. ” There should be some way for the user to decide on content display.
Maybe you could have a section on the front page that pulls the most viewed headlines and displays the links. Then give the user the option to choose their main news feed for the home page .. local / war / business / religion etc..
your going to beg me to go to bed soon!!
Tell ya what Dan - i f you want, feel free to re-design the site. If it’s good, I’ll present it and see what people think.
The headlines, get headlines, todays feature were actually on the top where you were saying but got moved down - can’t remember why but they did.
The ads have to be that big and have to stay above the center fold as much as possible. We’ll be making some pretty good money for that which allows me to keep working at the Sentinel. So whereas I don’t like them and would love to give users to minumize them - it’s just not sellable that way.
I’ll change the dotted lines to solid and see how that looks. On the note of getting for stories above the centerfold - Maybe I’ll just make the picture a bit smaller and try to do some wrapping.
Having the ability to give user the option to choose their main news feed for the home page isn’t a possability with the tools I have. However - the BBC does something like this and tracks areas of the site that are clicked the most. Then those colors will change whereas other colors on the site morph to a lighter color. A little cookie action but might be possible for me to do.
We’re hoping to put registration on the Sentinel site sometime (don’t know when) and once that’s in place we’ll have a whole mess of new options for the users. Registration would be free.
Oh - one other thing - I’m going to be adding a preferance page to the site. Users will be able to change their font size, colors, and possibly block positions. Like moving the nav to the right and the ads to the left. Or the main content to the left and everything else to the right - you get the idea.
Obviously this would require cookies but I already have this working and is just a matter of getting my template in set in stone before I allow users to change it.
It will be cool though - i’ll tell ya that.
i couldn’t tell if you were being sarcastic or not with the re-design offer.
Either way i was just offering my opinions like you requested. I have no interest in re-designing the page and hoping that someone will like it enough to pay me.
hopefully you weren’t offended .. if you were i don’t understand why.
Hey Aaron,
When I contract the “+” signs I’m seeing double. Run the mouse over and it disappears. (Safari browser). Noy a criticism, just an FYI.
How about the weather up front?
Oh no Dan - I wasn’t being sarcastic at all. You’re thoughts have been very helpful. I’m very far from being offended in any way. Thanks for taking the time to look over it and helping me.
If you had some extra time and wanted to come up with a design I would be more than happy to suggest it to the paper. Seriously.
Howard - yes, I know about the Safari bug. That should be fixed with the next release of Safari (i think).
The more I look at it, the more I think that the line with the temp on it needs a color, and o’course the date
The more I look at it - the more I just don’t like it at all. I’m actually hoping to come up with another design. Many of the elements from this design will be pulled into the new design. I’m just looking for something a little more professional and don’t think I hit this one on the head.
Lookin for ideas from anyone that may have them :-)
Howard Says:
Make sure there is some eye catching content on the homepage to attract interest.
Scrolling on any page is evil. It would be nice to have any
page be screen-size but changing pages/screens still be fast.
Looks nice